That doesnt sound good [xx(]
Cheers
Jules
RatSport www.ratsport.co.uk
Cheers
Jules
RatSport www.ratsport.co.uk
Chassis numbers - Is yours tax exempt ??
- Thread starter will
- Start date
I had an informal chat with a dvla vehicle inspector at Shrewsbury
a few weeks ago when I registered a 1994 jap import trail bike..
I needed an offical dating letter for this, as it had never been registered in the UK. (or so I thought)..
I was asked to take the bike for inspection at Shrewsbury..
I asked the inspector about dating letters etc, and he explained that it is a bit of a misconseption that it needs to be from a so called vehicle dating expert, you can do it yourself if you know
models / dates etc.. We know the number of the last one off the line in Dec 72. So you could try it yourself..
But he did say that they are inspecting any motorbike that had not
got a letter from the manufacturer..
No mention of car/vans though..
Good luck..
a few weeks ago when I registered a 1994 jap import trail bike..
I needed an offical dating letter for this, as it had never been registered in the UK. (or so I thought)..
I was asked to take the bike for inspection at Shrewsbury..
I asked the inspector about dating letters etc, and he explained that it is a bit of a misconseption that it needs to be from a so called vehicle dating expert, you can do it yourself if you know
models / dates etc.. We know the number of the last one off the line in Dec 72. So you could try it yourself..
But he did say that they are inspecting any motorbike that had not
got a letter from the manufacturer..
No mention of car/vans though..
Good luck..
Hang on a minute.
Is it fair to assume that all variants of the PB had sequential chassis numbers that depended on the date of completion of manufacture? So the pick-ups used for the Highwayman are in the same sequence as vans used for campers.
Is that the way chassis numbers work? I thought chassis numbers gave details of original specification; the engine spec, manual or auto, overdrive, body whether van or pick up, that sort of thing. In which case the chassis number would have been allocated before the vehicle was completed. In which case the last six digits of the chassis number of the last PB off the line can't possibly be used as a simple 'any number before is earlier, any number after is later' determinant.
Does anyone know what each of the sixteen digits in the Commer PB chassis number mean? (I've figured out what the first two letters mean!)
And why would the VOSA MOT info sheet printed out by the MOT computer give year of first use as 1971 for a vehicle first registered 1973. Does VOSA know stuff we don't?
It seems to me the forum needs access to the line book, which would normally have been made available to an owners club years ago - except that there doesn't seem to be a Commer owners club. Have Renault given/sold the info to Mike Worthington-Williams with the intention he should be charging for it? Or maybe he just charges for a verification certificate if he is able to confirm pre-1973 manufacture which hasn't been said yet on this thread and would be be fine (I can't quite bring myself to shell out thirty quid to learn we just missed the boat but would happily pay an admin fee for confirmation of good news).
Can anyone help me to get my head around this?
Brilliant forum by the way ...
Is it fair to assume that all variants of the PB had sequential chassis numbers that depended on the date of completion of manufacture? So the pick-ups used for the Highwayman are in the same sequence as vans used for campers.
Is that the way chassis numbers work? I thought chassis numbers gave details of original specification; the engine spec, manual or auto, overdrive, body whether van or pick up, that sort of thing. In which case the chassis number would have been allocated before the vehicle was completed. In which case the last six digits of the chassis number of the last PB off the line can't possibly be used as a simple 'any number before is earlier, any number after is later' determinant.
Does anyone know what each of the sixteen digits in the Commer PB chassis number mean? (I've figured out what the first two letters mean!)
And why would the VOSA MOT info sheet printed out by the MOT computer give year of first use as 1971 for a vehicle first registered 1973. Does VOSA know stuff we don't?
It seems to me the forum needs access to the line book, which would normally have been made available to an owners club years ago - except that there doesn't seem to be a Commer owners club. Have Renault given/sold the info to Mike Worthington-Williams with the intention he should be charging for it? Or maybe he just charges for a verification certificate if he is able to confirm pre-1973 manufacture which hasn't been said yet on this thread and would be be fine (I can't quite bring myself to shell out thirty quid to learn we just missed the boat but would happily pay an admin fee for confirmation of good news).
Can anyone help me to get my head around this?
Brilliant forum by the way ...
Copied from the first post on this thread:
"The date of registration not important !!
Remember that most campers sat around at convertors for many many months before being converted and registered..
The last PB off the production line in Jan 1973 had the chassis number-158645. ( the magic number.. )
So if your chassis number is prior to this one it is tax exempt.."
Now where he says Jan 1973 I believe he means 'end of' Dec 1972 as that is the cut-off date. If the chassis number he quotes relates to the last vehicle completed in Dec 1972 then your one would seem to be earlier and therefore qualifies for free VEL. But double-check yourself, don't rely on me!
Peggy drinks too much!
If I told you I was a pathological liar, would you believe me?
"The date of registration not important !!
Remember that most campers sat around at convertors for many many months before being converted and registered..
The last PB off the production line in Jan 1973 had the chassis number-158645. ( the magic number.. )
So if your chassis number is prior to this one it is tax exempt.."
Now where he says Jan 1973 I believe he means 'end of' Dec 1972 as that is the cut-off date. If the chassis number he quotes relates to the last vehicle completed in Dec 1972 then your one would seem to be earlier and therefore qualifies for free VEL. But double-check yourself, don't rely on me!
Peggy drinks too much!
If I told you I was a pathological liar, would you believe me?
Let's say i brought a van with the chassis number reading 158247, would it be exempt from the horrid TAX?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA!!!
Hi Scott!If the number quoted above (158645) is the last tax-exempt chassis, and if the numbering was logical, then the one you quote would be earlier and therefore also tax-exempt. BUT, don't take my word for it, check with the guy mentioned earlier in the thread.
Peggy drinks too much!
If I told you I was a pathological liar, would you believe me?
Peggy drinks too much!
If I told you I was a pathological liar, would you believe me?
How do i get in contact with this Worthington chap then?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA!!!
Panky
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA!!!
bobs all good not paid tax since i had her 9 years ago! yes
[8D]
i have a commer lol
[8D]
i have a commer lol
I love digging up old threads but think I've got a worthy contribution to this. All be it not specific to Commers.First things first, the Build Date is what dictates whether a vehicle is classed as a historic vehicle and is therefore exempt from paying for road tax. This build date has to be pre 01 January 1973. ie Built in 1972 or before.
The registration date is what is on the log book.
A car has to be built before it is registered. Therefore if the registration date is after 01 January 1973 it does not automatically mean it isn't going to be classified as a historic vehicle.
In fact, from memory I seem to recall that teh DVLA will allow cars that were registered early in 1973 to be reclassified as historic as it is assumed/expected that they were built before 1 Jan 1973. Very decent of them. From memory it is anything registered in the first two, or possibly three weeks of 1973. Practical Classics had a big article on it some time ago.
For example;
I have a Manta that was registered in July 1973, but was built pre August 1972. I have been able to prove this via information from the Opel factory and the Chassis numbers. Therefore my Manta is classified as historic.
Conversely a friend of mine has a Manta that was registered in March 1973, but was built in Feb 1973. Therefore his is not classified as historic and has to pay tax. (He wasn't amused either, I can tell you)
Hope this example helps.
Furthermore though, when I tried reclassifying my Manta I had further problems.
The DVLA office in Lincoln wanted to issue my Manta with a K-registration instead of the L-reg it's had since new.
The reason for this? Because I couldn't prove an exact build date they wanted to default it automatically to 01 January 1972.
Apparently this is the usual practice for cars where an exact build day cannot be determined. So they do not appear newer than they are and therefore sell for more money.
Obviously I wasn't happy with this as the 30-something years of history would be worthless and it would affect the cars resale value. But no they were determined.
Eventually, a little old lady who's been there since the dawn of time happened to overhear what was going on and quoted a rule that even the manager and so called specialists there didn't know, stating that historic vehicles are exempt from this first law. In the main because its mileage & condition much more than a couple of months on the age that affects a historic cars value.
So, a word of warning, if this happens to you, stand your ground!
The registration date is what is on the log book.
A car has to be built before it is registered. Therefore if the registration date is after 01 January 1973 it does not automatically mean it isn't going to be classified as a historic vehicle.
In fact, from memory I seem to recall that teh DVLA will allow cars that were registered early in 1973 to be reclassified as historic as it is assumed/expected that they were built before 1 Jan 1973. Very decent of them. From memory it is anything registered in the first two, or possibly three weeks of 1973. Practical Classics had a big article on it some time ago.
For example;
I have a Manta that was registered in July 1973, but was built pre August 1972. I have been able to prove this via information from the Opel factory and the Chassis numbers. Therefore my Manta is classified as historic.
Conversely a friend of mine has a Manta that was registered in March 1973, but was built in Feb 1973. Therefore his is not classified as historic and has to pay tax. (He wasn't amused either, I can tell you
)Hope this example helps.
Furthermore though, when I tried reclassifying my Manta I had further problems.
The DVLA office in Lincoln wanted to issue my Manta with a K-registration instead of the L-reg it's had since new.
The reason for this? Because I couldn't prove an exact build date they wanted to default it automatically to 01 January 1972.
Apparently this is the usual practice for cars where an exact build day cannot be determined. So they do not appear newer than they are and therefore sell for more money.
Obviously I wasn't happy with this as the 30-something years of history would be worthless and it would affect the cars resale value. But no they were determined.
Eventually, a little old lady who's been there since the dawn of time happened to overhear what was going on and quoted a rule that even the manager and so called specialists there didn't know, stating that historic vehicles are exempt from this first law. In the main because its mileage & condition much more than a couple of months on the age that affects a historic cars value.
So, a word of warning, if this happens to you, stand your ground!
