The later vans had 4.77 diffs to accommodate for dropping to 14” wheels. I’ve got a small case 4.22 diff ready to fit - it’s off a Hawk I think but ultra ultra rare as most are 4.55 and have a bigger casings. I think youd struggle to get a 4.22 unless very lucky
Overdrive gearbox for Pootle?
- Thread starter Pootle's Owner
- Start date
The alpine and minx diffs are defo too small, I’ve bought two Hawk diffs on the off chance they’d fit but they were both too big. Ended up getting the CWP changed on the Commer one.
I did manage to fit the longer overdrive gearbox but it was a bid of a bodge and I wished I’d done what Panky did. the gearbox was canted over and the linkage was adjusted to its limit, also had to bend the gear stick and make new gearbox cross member and shorten hybrid prop. Worked okay for a few years until a UJ failed causing the prop to wobble and fractured the overdrive casing. Total loss of drive!
From memory there are loads of vids on YouTube on how to strip and rebuild these gearboxes.
I did manage to fit the longer overdrive gearbox but it was a bid of a bodge and I wished I’d done what Panky did. the gearbox was canted over and the linkage was adjusted to its limit, also had to bend the gear stick and make new gearbox cross member and shorten hybrid prop. Worked okay for a few years until a UJ failed causing the prop to wobble and fractured the overdrive casing. Total loss of drive!
From memory there are loads of vids on YouTube on how to strip and rebuild these gearboxes.
Here's the stickied thread for the gearbox, very good vid included
New OD old Gearbox...With Gearbox Strip Down Vid
Had the OD professionally rebuilt this winter due to leaks and being on the verge of slipping however on the gearbox output shaft now the OD’s off there is a fair bit of float - I’m talking 2mm maybe. It seems to be the bearing shell that’s moving in the gearbox case rather than worn inner...
forum.commervanfan.co.uk
Pootle's Owner
Active Member
Hi folks. In the end I stripped down both boxes and rebuilt Pootles box with the overdrive mainshaft from the 'alpine' box.
As suggested above, the 'Alpine' box wasn't actually from an Alpine but has ratios from a 'standard' car (according to the Rootes manual).
All in all not a bad project and I now have faith that Pootles box is sound - bearings and synchros were fine and I only fitted new oilseals.
Only bit that needed fettling was the overdrive solenoid which needed the bore/piston cleaning up and the contacts on the coil switch cleaning with emery cloth. Total cost £11 for seals.
I have sorted part of the rear mount but am awaiting some bits of metal to finish that off.
I have stripped the propshaft and await new UJs then it's off to Feltham next week to be smallen-ed by 3" - quote is £80 + VAT including balancing so not worth risking doing it myself!
As suggested above, the 'Alpine' box wasn't actually from an Alpine but has ratios from a 'standard' car (according to the Rootes manual).
All in all not a bad project and I now have faith that Pootles box is sound - bearings and synchros were fine and I only fitted new oilseals.
Only bit that needed fettling was the overdrive solenoid which needed the bore/piston cleaning up and the contacts on the coil switch cleaning with emery cloth. Total cost £11 for seals.
I have sorted part of the rear mount but am awaiting some bits of metal to finish that off.
I have stripped the propshaft and await new UJs then it's off to Feltham next week to be smallen-ed by 3" - quote is £80 + VAT including balancing so not worth risking doing it myself!
Brave
Pootle's Owner
Active Member
or foolhardy......
A neighbor spoke to me the other day as I was working on the Commer and asked how I knew how to do 'all this engine' stuff. He wasn't sure I meant it when I said, I'm just arrogant enough to think I can do it, so I crack-on and give it a go and when it goes wrong I do it again until I get it right.
Actually it's generally an interesting learning exercise for me and it's in my genes - in 1974 I was 16 and wanted a motorbike as my dad had been a rider. One day he brought home a Suzuki 50cc with a bust engine and told me I could ride it when I was 7 if I fixed it. My first engine rebuild - it was a crap bike but a good experience.
A neighbor spoke to me the other day as I was working on the Commer and asked how I knew how to do 'all this engine' stuff. He wasn't sure I meant it when I said, I'm just arrogant enough to think I can do it, so I crack-on and give it a go and when it goes wrong I do it again until I get it right.
Actually it's generally an interesting learning exercise for me and it's in my genes - in 1974 I was 16 and wanted a motorbike as my dad had been a rider. One day he brought home a Suzuki 50cc with a bust engine and told me I could ride it when I was 7 if I fixed it. My first engine rebuild - it was a crap bike but a good experience.
Photos of the rear mount please! I am intending to do the same conversion to my Wanderer.
I got a toolbox for my 9th birthday and told to dismantle a rotten Morris traveller on the drive for spares - hooked
I'm always annoyed when people say to me something like "of course you're lucky to have the skills". I usually put them right on the amount of luck involved in aquiring the skills, and the amount of failures involved.
And painful knuckles
Pootle's Owner
Active Member
and here is latest stupid mistake learning exercise... I needed a couple of UJs for the propshaft and bought the wrong ones on t'internet!
Why didn't I contact Martin - he supplied clutch and stuff so why didn't I think of him first?
Hope he can supply correct ones and I can get shaft sorted in next couple of weeks.
Why didn't I contact Martin - he supplied clutch and stuff so why didn't I think of him first?
Hope he can supply correct ones and I can get shaft sorted in next couple of weeks.
Pootle's Owner
Active Member
So rogermf wanted some pictures of rear mount on the overdrive gearbox.
Happily using the Commer bellhousing means the mounting points on the chassis don't change and the mounting block for the overdrive is almost inline with the ones on the original mounting plate.
As original plate won't fit the Overdrive housing I chopped off the lower half and kept the top part which keeps the top three gearbox holes and the holes for the bolts to the chassis.
I then used some 40mm angle I had lying around to make some strengthening lugs on the hacked top piece and made up a new bottom support from some old strip and another bit of angle.
Hope the pictures make sense of it all....
Only two minor issues;
1) The top 3 screws into the gearbox are hard to reach with new arrangement and I need to use allen screws as hex heads aren't accesible (5/16" x 1 1/4" UNC)
3) The top cast web on the overdrive stops the old bracket fitting so we welded a strap over the top to clear the web and cut the old bracket to clear
It looks a bit heath-robinson but with a few more bits of welding then grinding/cleaning/painting it should be OK...
All a bit brick-outhouse tech but I think it's strong enough!
Happily using the Commer bellhousing means the mounting points on the chassis don't change and the mounting block for the overdrive is almost inline with the ones on the original mounting plate.
As original plate won't fit the Overdrive housing I chopped off the lower half and kept the top part which keeps the top three gearbox holes and the holes for the bolts to the chassis.
I then used some 40mm angle I had lying around to make some strengthening lugs on the hacked top piece and made up a new bottom support from some old strip and another bit of angle.
Hope the pictures make sense of it all....
Only two minor issues;
1) The top 3 screws into the gearbox are hard to reach with new arrangement and I need to use allen screws as hex heads aren't accesible (5/16" x 1 1/4" UNC)
3) The top cast web on the overdrive stops the old bracket fitting so we welded a strap over the top to clear the web and cut the old bracket to clear
It looks a bit heath-robinson but with a few more bits of welding then grinding/cleaning/painting it should be OK...
All a bit brick-outhouse tech but I think it's strong enough!
Pootle's Owner
Active Member
ready to go in when I can face the cold task....
Attachments
Pootle's Owner
Active Member
Before fitting the gearbox I thought I should check linkage parts and found the universal joint was badly worn and the spherical bearing on the cross-shaft had crumbled to nothing so machined new shafts and bushes for UJ and new spherical bearing from PTFE....
No excuses left so fitting tomorrow - what could possibly go wrong?
No excuses left so fitting tomorrow - what could possibly go wrong?
Pootle's Owner
Active Member
Eventful day today....
Became grandad for the first time.... well-done Ella and Luke (and baby Leo of course)
....and also fitted Pootle's gearbox with eldest son Ben.
As usual with jobs expected to have problems, it all worked out fine in the end - key element was using a couple of 10" long bits of studding to align the bellhousing to the engine so we just pushed the gearbox along them with jack for support and it slipped onto clutch splines with no fuss.
Fettled gearlinkage all went together nicely and just as we were knocking-off for the day, I got a call to say propshaft is ready for collection!
In the end it was all straightforward so I thought I'd bolt-up the recently re-cored radiator -How hard could it be?
I do wonder when fighting such things, what moron thought putting fixing screws in such locations was a good idea?
- Made up some suitable long shoulder bolts to make the task managable and repeatable without too much blasphemy!
Only need propshaft fitting and overdrive switch wiring and should be ready for a test drive.....
Tony
Became grandad for the first time.... well-done Ella and Luke (and baby Leo of course)
....and also fitted Pootle's gearbox with eldest son Ben.
As usual with jobs expected to have problems, it all worked out fine in the end - key element was using a couple of 10" long bits of studding to align the bellhousing to the engine so we just pushed the gearbox along them with jack for support and it slipped onto clutch splines with no fuss.
Fettled gearlinkage all went together nicely and just as we were knocking-off for the day, I got a call to say propshaft is ready for collection!
In the end it was all straightforward so I thought I'd bolt-up the recently re-cored radiator -How hard could it be?
I do wonder when fighting such things, what moron thought putting fixing screws in such locations was a good idea?
- Made up some suitable long shoulder bolts to make the task managable and repeatable without too much blasphemy!
Only need propshaft fitting and overdrive switch wiring and should be ready for a test drive.....
Tony